Teaching for Intercession 14.04.06
9. Discerning the spirits: of Jesus, demons, the dead, in preachers etc.
2 Kings 18:4 4 He removed the high places and broke the pillars and cut down the Asherah. And he broke in pieces the bronze serpent that Moses had made, for until those days the people of Israel had made offerings to it (it was called Nehushtan).
This is about the cross and people lighting candles to their own remembrance for the sick and dying. Trying to catch the ‘after glow’ to their own event rather than the memory and reality of the cross. There is lip service to the cross but no centrality of the cross in people’s lives.
John 8:21-24,25,28,30
21 So he said to them again, “I am going away, and you will seek me, and you will die in your sin. Where I am going, you cannot come.” 22 So the Jews said, “Will he kill himself, since he says, ‘Where I am going, you cannot come’?” 23 He said to them, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. 24 I told you that you would die in your sins, for unless you believe that I am he you will die in your sins.”
25 So they said to him, “Who are you?” Jesus said to them, “Just what I have been telling you from the beginning.
28 So Jesus said to them, “When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am he, and that I do nothing on my own authority, but speak just as the Father taught me.
30 As he was saying these things, many believed in him.
How would the lifting up of the cross cause the Jews to realize that Jesus is the I AM from the beginning – His oneness with the Father?
John 12:31,32,-37 31 Now is the judgment of this world; now will the ruler of this world be cast out.
32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.”
34 So the crowd answered him, “We have heard from the Law that the Christ remains forever. How can you say that the Son of Man must be lifted up? Who is this Son of Man?” 35 So Jesus said to them, “The light is among you for a little while longer. Walk while you have the light, lest darkness overtake you. The one who walks in the darkness does not know where he is going. 36 While you have the light, believe in the light, that you may become sons of light.” 37 Though he had done so many signs before them, they still did not believe in him,
Matthew 5:14-16 14 “You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden. 15 Nor do people light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on a stand, and it gives light to all in the house. 16 In the same way, let your light shine before others, so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.
The lifting up of a light on a lampstand is the same as lifting Jesus up on a cross. The purpose is to enlighten everybody.
Revelation 21:22 22 And I saw no temple in the city, for its temple is the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb.
Luke 11:33-36 33 “No one after lighting a lamp puts it in a cellar or under a basket, but on a stand, so that those who enter may see the light. 34 Your eye is the lamp of your body. When your eye is healthy, your whole body is full of light, but when it is bad, your body is full of darkness. 35 Therefore be careful lest the light in you be darkness. 36 If then your whole body is full of light, having no part dark, it will be wholly bright, as when a lamp with its rays gives you light.”
The city is the Church, the body of Christ. It is the fulfilment of Scripture when it is full of light. Why isn’t the Church today radiating the light of Christ? There are many false lights being lit inside the Church. Those false lights are illuminating the conscience of the worshippers according to their own desires. In today’s modern worship phenomena, people are trying to sustain a memory by an energy. It is comforting and perpetuates a memory. It is both a form of reverence/godliness and denial i.e. a denial of the power of the cross. If there are false lights in the Church, why aren’t they discerned?
John 12:35 35 So Jesus said to them, “The light is among you for a little while longer. Walk while you have the light, lest darkness overtake you. The one who walks in the darkness does not know where he is going.
Ephesians 6:12 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places.
People are trying to look inside other people to receive lights. They follow the spirit of people through personalities and books etc to receive illumination rather than Jesus Himself. The light within people is darkness. Why don’t we discern the demonic or see the darkness in ourselves in all this? We can only see the darkness in someone else when we are aware that it has been cast out of us.
Colossians 1:13 13 He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son,
For those still in the ‘domain of darkness’ there is only a disturbance of the vibes or energy as exhibited by “Barry” at the Psychic Expo at Hilary’s. i.e they sense something is “wrong” when Christians are around. What New Age people cannot do is differentiate their experience of a counter-light into a person. They cannot discern between the presence of an energy and the presence of a person who is Jesus, i.e. That is the “I AM He”. It has to be something that is completely distinct about the presence and person. When they do discern the person, they become worshippers of Christ.
Acts 26:17-18 17 delivering you from your people and from the Gentiles— to whom I am sending you 18 to open their eyes, so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and a place among those who are sanctified by faith in me.’
This is the problem in the Church. Christ is always present in the Church, which is what constitutes the Church. He walks between the candlesticks but people cannot differentiate between the presence of an energy and the presence of a person who is Jesus within their midst. There has to be something completely distinct between the reality of the presence and the recognition of the person.
Exodus 33:12-23 (ESV)
12 Moses said to the Lord, “See, you say to me, ‘Bring up this people,’ but you have not let me know whom you will send with me. Yet you have said, ‘I know you by name, and you have also found favor in my sight.’ 13 Now therefore, if I have found favor in your sight, please show me now your ways, that I may know you in order to find favor in your sight. Consider too that this nation is your people.” 14 And he said, “My presence will go with you, and I will give you rest.” 15 And he said to him, “If your presence will not go with me, do not bring us up from here. 16 For how shall it be known that I have found favor in your sight, I and your people? Is it not in your going with us, so that we are distinct, I and your people, from every other people on the face of the earth?” 17 And the Lord said to Moses, “This very thing that you have spoken I will do, for you have found favor in my sight, and I know you by name.” 18 Moses said, “Please show me your glory.” 19 And he said, “I will make all my goodness pass before you and will proclaim before you my name ‘The Lord.’ And I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will show mercy on whom I will show mercy. 20 But,” he said, “you cannot see my face, for man shall not see me and live.” 21 And the Lord said, “Behold, there is a place by me where you shall stand on the rock, 22 and while my glory passes by I will put you in a cleft of the rock, and I will cover you with my hand until I have passed by. 23 Then I will take away my hand, and you shall see my back, but my face shall not be seen.”
Moses prays “Show me your glory” but God says (1)“I will make all my goodness pass before you and (2) I will proclaim before you my name”
Philippians 2:9,119 Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, 11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
God fulfilled Moses’ prayer in the revelation of Jesus Christ in the Gospel as both the glory and name. Everybody wants the glory but who wants goodness?, i.e., they want the feeling without the commitment and responsibility. What would it really mean to relate to a dead person?
1 Samuel 28:11-20 11 Then the woman said, “Whom shall I bring up for you?” He said, “Bring up Samuel for me.” 12 When the woman saw Samuel, she cried out with a loud voice. And the woman said to Saul, “Why have you deceived me? You are Saul.” 13 The king said to her, “Do not be afraid. What do you see?” And the woman said to Saul, “I see a god coming up out of the earth.” 14 He said to her, “What is his appearance?” And she said, “An old man is coming up, and he is wrapped in a robe.” And Saul knew that it was Samuel, and he bowed with his face to the ground and paid homage. 15 Then Samuel said to Saul, “Why have you disturbed me by bringing me up?” Saul answered, “I am in great distress, for the Philistines are warring against me, and God has turned away from me and answers me no more, either by prophets or by dreams. Therefore I have summoned you to tell me what I shall do.” 16 And Samuel said, “Why then do you ask me, since the Lord has turned from you and become your enemy? 17 The Lord has done to you as he spoke by me, for the Lord has torn the kingdom out of your hand and given it to your neighbor, David. 18 Because you did not obey the voice of the Lord and did not carry out his fierce wrath against Amalek, therefore the Lord has done this thing to you this day. 19 Moreover, the Lord will give Israel also with you into the hand of the Philistines, and tomorrow you and your sons shall be with me. The Lord will give the army of Israel also into the hand of the Philistines.” 20 Then Saul fell at once full length on the ground, filled with fear because of the words of Samuel. And there was no strength in him, for he had eaten nothing all day and all night.
The medium freaks out because there is a definition about the spirit that overwhelms her, that is, the concentration of the personal identity of the spirit of a prophet from God who will speak with authority. There is nothing in the story which suggests that Samuel is a familiar spirit. What she saw was an “elohim”, a divinised human being (Samuel). If your mother was experiencing the presence of your (deceased) father in his present glory, she would freak out and if the psychics were able to experience real persons who had passed from death to life, they would freak out too. When psychics “see” the dead –they are really seeing a fusion between psychological desire and demonic influence.
Matthew 15:1-14 1 Then Pharisees and scribes came to Jesus from Jerusalem and said, 2 “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat.” 3 He answered them, “And why do you break the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘Whoever reviles father or mother must surely die.’ 5 But you say, ‘If anyone tells his father or his mother, What you would have gained from me is given to God, 6 he need not honor his father.’ So for the sake of your tradition you have made void the word of God. 7 You hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, when he said: 8 “ ‘This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me; 9 in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ” 10 And he called the people to him and said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 it is not what goes into the mouth that defiles a person, but what comes out of the mouth; this defiles a person.” 12 Then the disciples came and said to him, “Do you know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?” 13 He answered, “Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be rooted up. 14 Let them alone; they are blind guides. And if the blind lead the blind, both will fall into a pit.”
The divine command to honour their father and mother was overridden by claiming to give to God what they should have given to their parents.
Matthew 23:16-20 16 “Woe to you, blind guides, who say, ‘If anyone swears by the temple, it is nothing, but if anyone swears by the gold of the temple, he is bound by his oath.’ 17 You blind fools! For which is greater, the gold or the temple that has made the gold sacred? 18 And you say, ‘If anyone swears by the altar, it is nothing, but if anyone swears by the gift that is on the altar, he is bound by his oath.’ 19 You blind men! For which is greater, the gift or the altar that makes the gift sacred? 20 So whoever swears by the altar swears by it and by everything on it.
God has promised to indwell the temple not the gold in the temple. The problem is the attributing to impersonal things the power of the divine. They were looking at the bronze snake, but there was nothing in the snake. Likewise, in some traditional forms of Christianity, the statue of Jesus is worshipped instead of Jesus Himself. Saul asked for a spirit, but he got an elohim which spoke judgment to him. No-one calls up a divine being today anticipating a word of judgment. That is why we don’t want Jesus in the Church. People are trying to call Jesus up by their singing, tithing, candle-lighting or merely going to Church.
Romans 1:22-23 22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools, 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.
Revelation 13:15 15 And it was allowed to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast might even speak and might cause those who would not worship the image of the beast to be slain.
The principle here is that the most powerful testimony in the arena of idolatry can be given by someone who has been restored from death to life, e.g. raised from the dead or healed by Jesus. People were healed by the bronze snake in the desert. If they had not been healed, it would never have become an idol.
Acts 14:8-11 8 Now at Lystra there was a man sitting who could not use his feet. He was crippled from birth and had never walked. 9 He listened to Paul speaking. And Paul, looking intently at him and seeing that he had faith to be made well, 10 said in a loud voice, “Stand upright on your feet.” And he sprang up and began walking. 11 And when the crowds saw what Paul had done, they lifted up their voices, saying in Lycaonian, “The gods have come down to us in the likeness of men!”
The people wanted to worship Paul because they saw a man healed. Today, people sometimes kiss the cross. Others visit shrines because of supposed appearances just like people visit Hillsong because there was supposed to have been an appearance there. The point is that no-one comes to the idol to be killed or die from their sin. Whereas, to come to Jesus Himself is to die or live a sacrificial life. What today, is the equivalent in our society to the need for physical healing in the ancient world? Emotional and psychological healing, but God is giving people over to their sickness because they will not face up to their sins.
Matthew 16:24-26 24 Then Jesus told his disciples, “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me. 25 For whoever would save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will find it. 26 For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world and forfeits his life? Or what shall a man give in return for his life?
People searching in all the wrong places for life.
Ecclesiastes 12:7 7 and the dust returns to the earth as it was, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.
When one encounters a person (not a spirit) who has been returned from the dead, whether a Samuel, a Jesus or a saint (a holy person) it is apparent they live by the power of another (than themselves)and that their spirit does not belong to them.
John 19:28-30 28 After this, Jesus, knowing that all was now finished, said (to fulfill the Scripture), “I thirst.” 29 A jar full of sour wine stood there, so they put a sponge full of the sour wine on a hyssop branch and held it to his mouth. 30 When Jesus had received the sour wine, he said, “It is finished,” and he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.
Jesus gave up His spirit which returned to God.
Luke 24:36-37 36 As they were talking about these things, Jesus himself stood among them, and said to them, “Peace to you!” 37 But they were startled and frightened and thought they saw a spirit.
They thought they saw a ghost when they actually saw Jesus. Who are we worshipping – the spirits of living men and women or a crucified and risen human being? Why do people chase those who have global influence (Brian Houston)? They want the perceived glory of the person rather than the glory that comes from being killed and made alive. It is not their goodness they are followed for, but their popularity. The flesh craves relief but the Spirit of Jesus draws one to brokenness and pain – to God’s will over one’s own. There is an incorrect image worshipped today because the image which should be worshipped has nail and spear marks in it.
John 20:26-29 26 Eight days later, his disciples were inside again, and Thomas was with them. Although the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you.” 27 Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe.” 28 Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!” 29 Jesus said to him, “Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”
What is so important about the nail marks? They destroyed the image people had formed of Jesus when he was walking on the earth. The nail marks signify that Jesus is in no sense an apparition, that is, a desirable construct of the human soul for healing. Part of the perfection of Jesus is his deformity but we are trying to resurrect the Adamic perfection. Death can be seen in those who have been delivered, e.g. David Wilkerson, Paul etc. It is OK to worship the image of God in Christ but no pre -Adamic or post fallen Adamic image.
The principle is conformity to the object of worship. The worshipers of idols who are under the influence of spirit beings believe there is some power present in those beings which can deliver them from suffering because those beings are super-natural or post mortal. Thus, when people go to a clairvoyant they believe there is something in that spirit like deathlessness, peace etc which they want. Likewise, people sense something in a preacher’s spirit which presents post – mortem or post – suffering or post – economic deprivation which they want. However, when we see Jesus we see that the cross is the gate of glory (Archbishop Carey) but glory cannot be entered into except through the gate.
Revelation 21:22-27 22 And I saw no temple in the city, for its temple is the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb. 23 And the city has no need of sun or moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and its lamp is the Lamb. 24 By its light will the nations walk, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it, 25 and its gates will never be shut by day—and there will be no night there. 26 They will bring into it the glory and the honor of the nations. 27 But nothing unclean will ever enter it, nor anyone who does what is detestable or false, but only those who are written in the Lamb’s book of life.
The gate is the entry to the new Jerusalem and unless people enter through the cross, their spirit cannot be enlightened and they will always see in darkness which itself, will be light to them. There is no brokenness in the preaching today. Satan thinks he’s good and God is evil.
Isaiah 45:7 7 I form light (Shalom) and create darkness (woe), I make well-being and create calamity, I am the Lord, who does all these things.
John 14:30 30 I will no longer talk much with you, for the ruler of this world is coming. He has no claim on me,
Ephesians 6:12 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places.
When the devil comes for Jesus he finds no darkness in him, he only has one longing – that for the Father.
John 14:11 11 Believe me that I am in the Father and the Father is in me, or else believe on account of the works themselves.
Jesus’ whole spirit is inhabited by the Father. The devil can give Jesus nothing because all he wants is His Father and he can only offer counterfeit or possessiveness (Gen 3) but never the goodness of the Father. He could only offer Jesus the nations and their glory (Matt 4). Satan can offer glory to a man but never the glory of God. Irenaeus: “The glory of God is a man fully alive”. For a man to be fully alive, he has to have been fully dead and for a man to have been fully dead, he would have had to have lost all the very goodness of the original created image which is what the cross does to Jesus when he is separated from access to the indwelling of the Father. The more personal is one’s need and desire the more interior they will seek that in another person, which is why evil spirits will present themselves as a human person, i.e. that is why they impersonate humans.
Revelation 13:11-14 11 Then I saw another beast rising out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb and it spoke like a dragon. 12 It exercises all the authority of the first beast in its presence, and makes the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose mortal wound was healed. 13 It performs great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in front of people, 14 and by the signs that it is allowed to work in the presence of the beast it deceives those who dwell on earth, telling them to make an image for the beast that was wounded by the sword and yet lived.
The image of the beast is an impersonation of the incarnation of a dying and rising God. For our greatest goodness, we need to be made new in the dying and rising God. When Jesus dies on the cross he experiences nothing but darkness because he has no access to the goodness of the Father because human beings have never sought that access and the absence of that access to the goodness of the Father is the wrath of God.
Isaiah 45:7 7 I form light and create darkness, I make well-being and create calamity, I am the Lord, who does all these things.
In the cross God in Christ exerts his supreme sovereignty over good and evil for us in that His full participation in evil is the fullness of His goodness, i.e. Jesus enters into the complete darkness of the human soul under the operation of evil spiritual darkness where the sum total of all darkness is taken into the light where it is destroyed.
Romans 2:15-16, 15 They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them 16 on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus.
Everyone knows there is darkness in their soul but they don’t want to deal with it. All they want is glory, well being etc, and they cannot find it because no amount of human energy can resolve the problem of the human conscience. This is why the sacrifices had to be perpetual because the very sacrifices reminded people of their culpability.
Romans 7:18 18 For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh. For I have the desire to do what is right, but not the ability to carry it out.
God is sovereign, not above darkness, not separated from it, but by His immersion, identification and indwelling in darkness in human persons (in the cross). This is the knowledge of God that demonic powers fear i.e. they fear Christians having this knowledge. Therefore, in the midst of our sin we are not alone because He (Jesus) was (on the cross). Guilt and shame are the most isolating elements in the experience of humanity, so, fundamentally, people are driven to achieve feeling well because they know they have lost the glory. They know they have lost the glory because they have lost the goodness but if they knew the restoration of the goodness, they would not have to chase another glory. The goodness and the glory of the cross are one.
Exodus 33:18-19 18 Moses said, “Please show me your glory.” 19 And he said, “I will make all my goodness pass before you and will proclaim before you my name ‘The Lord.’ And I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will show mercy on whom I will show mercy.
God hid Moses in the cleft of the rock because Moses had darkness in him and the fullness of the presence of the glory of God would have destroyed him. When God starts working on the darkness in our lives, it is an invitation to come into the light that we may experience the destruction of our evil deeds, i.e. coming in to the reality of the fact that they were destroyed. The whole drive of the spirit that dominates much of the Church is offering something one doesn’t have rather than entering into what is already ours in Christ. Whilst many popular preachers try to present themselves as glorified flesh rather than crucified flesh, people like David Wilkerson bear the image of the scars. No amount of power can pacify the human conscience for a need that absolves guilt, only the cross can achieve this.